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Post by Ben Herrington on Mar 31, 2010 20:00:11 GMT -5
Athletic Directors from around the Sonoma County and North Bay League have gotten together and will be pushing for a league realignment outside of NCS interest.
The North Coast Section will be exploring a possible realignment for the 2012 season, but there's no telling what if any action will be taken.
This realignment will require all ADs to agree per NCS rules. Here's what were looking at:
From SCL to NBL: Casa Grande Windsor
From NBL to SCL: Piner Elsie Allen
This realignment will be for all sports, not just football, but it seems this will help football a lot more, along with aligning leagues with schools more their size.
A meeting is scheduled for sometime in Mid-April. As it sits right now, the only school that is leaning against this is Piner. To my knowledge there is no other block. This will most likely go into effect if passed at the beginning of the 2011 school year.
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Post by scobserver on Mar 31, 2010 22:13:29 GMT -5
It is hard to believe Piner would be the only "block" to this plan.....Ben, I can't believe your sources are really accurate about this, or just wishful thinking on the NBL's part. And for ALL sports?
Petaluma okay with losing rival Casa, including twice yearly meetings in most sports? Healdsburg losing Windsor twice yearly? SR school district likewise losing twice a year contests among its schools--and cannot believe SR district bigwigs are willing to cut loose its two poorest and highest minority schools into the supposed diminished SCL, further highlighting the perceived "second rate" edness of Piner and Allen. (Presume this is why Piner might be against it.) And the other five SCL schools losing two schools that can draw decent to large crowds, to be replaced by the several dozen fan base of Piner and Allen?
Yes, realigning is invevitable--and jumbling things up ahead of schedule for football would be wise. But changing for all sports is just not necessary. Can anyone else imagine much enthusiasm for this, outside Rancho, Monty, and Newman?
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Post by Ben Herrington on Apr 1, 2010 0:03:58 GMT -5
For football this is a given. Putting Casa and Windsor with Newman, Monty, and Rancho would be very nice. For other sports, I dont know because I dont follow other sports are close as I do for football.
Given Petaluma would lost their rival in league play, it would free up Casa's entire non-league schedule of NBL teams which would give the chance to play Petaluma in the Egg Bowl in the non-league. Healdsburg would also have the same chance.
This could be seen a 'first rate' vs 'second rate' or it could be by size. It is a good idea to have the big schools in one league and the small schools in another, so this works just fine with respects to size. I havent the slightest idea why Piner is against the realignment.
... I have a strong feeling the NCS will push for nearly an identical realignment beginning in 2012 anyway.
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Post by scobserver on Apr 1, 2010 18:28:00 GMT -5
Yes, i think something like what you suggest might happen next realignment--although enrollments change so quickly nowadays. I especially doubt Petaluma will stay a D3 size for very long. But no sense messing up all the other sports now just because of football.
In fact, come realignment time, I would like to see all the leagues formed into several "relegation tables" for football only but keep the rest of the sports as is.
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Post by sainttown on Apr 28, 2010 2:35:35 GMT -5
Whatever materialized? Are Allen and Piner going to be moved to the SCL?
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Post by Ben Herrington on Apr 28, 2010 22:39:15 GMT -5
After the meeting, Piner is still dragging their feet. Only the AD is involved with this, I'm not sure what the opinions of the coaches are.
Unless Piner agrees, the Empire will need to wait until 2012, and only then will the NCS decide who goes where.
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Post by scobserver on Apr 29, 2010 19:14:33 GMT -5
Really, I do not think Piner is as all influential as this--there has to be other people holding back. And if the SCL ADs actually did sign off on this, i hope they also stopped to figure out how to replace the lost gate revenue with Piner and Allen instead of Casa and Windsor on the home skeds. And that the Santa Rosa USD ADs figured in the added travel expenses. And everyone stopped to think how it affects all the other sports too. If Piner's reluctance truly is the only reason why this did come about, I say "good for Piner!"
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Post by Ben Herrington on Apr 29, 2010 21:37:40 GMT -5
By NCS rules, all teams are required to sign off on the realignement. If one team doesnt, then nothing happens. (Piner).
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Post by scobserver on May 1, 2010 22:05:44 GMT -5
well, i guess.......i am surprised all 7 SCL schools so readily agreed to destroy what is basically a stable, successful league lineup for close to 30 years, in order to bail out the NBL superpowers and then even take on NBL's knottiest problems. Realignment is inevitible, but I think SCL schools would be quick to regret bringing it on themselves so quickly. Would the NBL schools ever be so helpful to the SCL?
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Post by 4thqtrcomeback on May 2, 2010 9:19:25 GMT -5
scobserver - Your argument is archaic at best, and that is why only one AD disagrees.
Who says this doesn't help any of the SCL schools? Casa and Windsor will certainly benefit not having to play as many teams in lower divisions. Elmo - D4, Healdsburg - D4, all other teams D3. Windsor & Casa will be able to get higher seeds in playoffs. Casa should never be in the same league as Elmo, period. Elmolino will actually have a chance to go .500 in league with Piner & Elsie joining.
Teams can schedule key rivalry games in the preseason if they wish: Windsor vs. Healdsburg, Casa Vs. Petaluma, etc. I could see some great new rivalries developing in the future such as Analy and Piner, Casa Vs. Newman, etc.
Most importantly, THE KIDS would benefit. After all, its not about some old guy keeping his small town rivalries. Its about creating competitive equality by pitting schools with more equal enrollment size against each other which in turn creates a better experience FOR THE KIDS. Right now, if I'm at Elmolino, there is no chance I think I can win league with Casa in my league, but if you replace Casa and Windsor with schools closer in enrollment, such as Piner and Elsie, they have a better shot. I don't think much is learned from getting beat consistently 48-0.
Why Piner is dragging their feet, I don't understand. Maybe Newman, Montgomery, and Rancho will have to continue roll them until 2012 so they will change their mind. I'm glad every other school doesn't have their heads up their______.
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Post by bella on May 2, 2010 12:37:01 GMT -5
Well said 4thqtr. I completeley agree. I like tradition and all that, but things do change. There hasn't been any change for nearly 25 years and this proposal would benefit schools like ElMo and Elsie.
If I remember correctly what seems kind of funny is the last time there was realingment, the school that was against it was.....Piner. They seemed quite happy in the SCL, won a few titles in football, playing schools there own size and didn't seem to want to go to the NBL. Now they don't want to leave the NBL for the SCL, their original league?
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Post by ladylogger on May 2, 2010 13:03:50 GMT -5
I would think that schools would want to be in a league of similar sized schools. In Humboldt County we have eight schools plus Del Norte which is in Del Norte County. That is nine schools that cover a large geographic area. The H-DN League is split into the Big 5 and Little 4 soley based on enrollment sizes hence the "big/little" name. In recent years of realignment Mckinleyville has drifted between the two so right now we are the Big 4 and Little 5. It seems to suit the schools. For a time Eureka was in D2 while the rest of the league was D3 or D4. Eureka and Del Norte currently have the highest enrollment with 1400 and 1200 respectively. St Bernards and Ferndale both have under 200. I would agree that it helps teams to play same size when it comes to NCS. Eureka has typically had to play D1 or D2 sized schools in pre season. While in different leagues, Ferndale plays Fortuna every year in a huge EeL River Rivarly game billed as the "Milk Can Game" with the winning school holding the milk can until the following year. Just thought I would let you know how we do it way up north.
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Post by okyoureright on May 2, 2010 17:24:36 GMT -5
From a strictly football perspective, I don't understand why Petaluma is OK with this. Petaluma and Sonoma would be the only D3 schools left in the SCL. If either team has an average preseason they have little chance of making the playoffs. I don't believe this will make the SCL more competitive, there will just be a huge dropoff in competition from the 4th ranked team to the 5th. And when you think about other sports, this merger makes no sense at all. I hope this doesnt happen
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Post by scobserver on May 2, 2010 19:25:01 GMT -5
I agree that football obviously needs a massive overhaul--my argument is that this proposal ruins all the other sports. Success in football is so complicated nowadays that I am in favor of major revision (such as relegation tables--or placing Allen with similar urban schools with serious football problems, ie DeAnza and Richmond in the east bay, for football only.) Something drastic needs to be done for football, and soon. Yes, find a way for players at El Mo and Allen to have a shot for football success--which is great and a legitimate reason for change. And then the big guys do not have to worry about their precious playoff seedings--which is what this is really all about. But the SCL schools need to think of overall athletic department needs. The NBL, in a wide but generally accurate statement, draws less crowds and generates less interest in all sports, overall, than in the SCL. The SCL is fortunate to still remain so vibrant after all these years; few leagues have achieved such stability, and the SCL should not so casually commit suicide. Yes, Piner at its founding was in the SCL (actually the NBL II as it was called, formalizing its "inferiority" to the the then-named NBL I)....I do not recall them ever winning a football title, but they were competitive. Rancho was a member too even when it was briefly named Rohnert Park High. So was Newman--I don't think anyone suggests either of them return. I think the football competitiveness problem requires a solution--but it goes beyond the NBL. It is a special problem and requires a special solution not related to the rest of the sports. ladylogger, thanks for the HDN perspective. and by the way 4th quarter.... "its not about some old guy keeping his small town rivalries." OUCH! But somewhat accurate--I am not ashamed to say that preserving tradition is worth striving for, as long as it benefits the kids, which is your excellent point. And something must be done to save the Allen kids from complete demoralization and the likely destruction of the program there. I'd just like to see such solutions limited to football, at least until the actual realignment time comes.
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Post by 4thqtrcomeback on May 2, 2010 19:50:26 GMT -5
Here is this year's enrollment with next season's divisions for football. It makes too much sense to make this move, so it will probably never get done. Casa and Windsor playing schools with 1,000 less students in the same league as the SCL stands now, is ridiculous!
Santa Rosa - 1998 -D2 Casa Grande - 1909 - D2 Windsor - 1781 - D2 Rancho - 1771 - D2 Montgomery - 1756 - D2 Ukiah - 1683 - D2 Maria Carrillo - 1590 - D2 Newman - Private - D2
Petaluma - 1385 - D3 Sonoma - 1320 - D3 Analy - 1281 - D3 Piner - 1242 - D3 Elsie Allan - 1223 - D3 El Molino - 864 - D4 Healdsburg 797 - D4
scobserver - from some of your prior posts, I know your passionate about your SCL, so I had to talk some extra smack. I'm glad you're laughing about it and not taking it personal.
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